On glass you mean?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rucker61
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On glass you mean?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rucker61
Well, glass plus mount.Quote:
Originally Posted by hghclsswhitetrsh
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rucker61
There's always the shooter who's upgrading to the $5K optic, looking to sell their $3-4 K for a good price. That's the only way i was able to get beck in to some distance shooting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rucker61
$4k on glass and mount is not necessary. Especially to get started. I know a lot of guys love the S&B scopes, but I don't actually care for them. The glass is amazingly clear, the reticle works, but there is something about looking through them that doesn't seem to work for me. My Steiners are noticeably more "comfortable" (bad word for it, but best I can come up with), and the time I have spent behind the Vortex scopes has also been very good.
For getting started, you can learn with a $300 Super Sniper fixed 10x. Quite a few guys I know have started there, and shot to 1k yds, and then upgraded. They also sold their super sniper for not much less than new price when they upgraded.
The Vortex Razor Gen II 4.5-27 is a phenomenal scope, and it with a Spurh mount, top of the line but not necessary, would be under $3k. The Vortex with good rings would be mid $2k.
The big thing with scopes, that I have found, is CALL the vendors for the scope you want. They all list the scope at the same price that is usually set by the manufacturer, but they all have ways of making the sale a little better.
Also, look used on here, ARFCOM, Snipershide, and the like. Not long ago Great Kazoo had a fantastic deal on a Steiner 5-25 on here. You could have had that with a good set of rings for quite a bit less than $2k. I've seen several Gen 1 Razors listed on here in the last few months. Also sub $2k.
Not at all, but if you're going to go the competition route and do it even semi-seriously, then yes you will need to spend big money, it's not a cheap sport to compete in. For example I have over $7500 wrapped up in my primary rifle and optic, as well as about the same amount into my secondary one, then there's probably another $5k in ancillary equipment. Then consider I've completely shot out 3 barrels already this year with over 5000 rounds down range between matches and practice in my bolt guns, and you'll see why I say what I do. Simply put, a Savage, RPR, etc won't ever hold up AND PERFORM to this level over much more than a season or 2 and your money is much better spent going for the best gear right out of the gate.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rucker61
It all depends on what you're looking to do with LR shooting. Like I told the OP if it's just for your own enjoyment a factory rifle with sufficient glass to do what you want to do is more than enough, and there's no good reason to invest in second rig of the same class for doing that as a backup to save a trip to the range. It's too much investment for the return, unless you just have a penchant for having quantity over quality.
I just highly advise that for those looking to go down the competitive road, to skip the middle section of building up slowly, as it costs a hell of a lot more money in the long run. BTDT and nearly every person I know in the competitive side of this wishes someone would have told them this, or at least that they had listened when someone did.
I started out with a Trued up Rem 700 with a good barrel in an AI Chassis with a Vortex Razor Gen1 on it, That rifle cost me roughly $4k to put together. It did just fine, was not a limitation on my learning curve etc, then I built a second rifle on another trued up 700 but with a few more upgrades and that cost about the same amount as the first plus about $800, but had a different chassis and scope and chambered in a different cartridge. Then I sold the first one and finally built one on a custom action for my primary rifle, then upgraded glass to a top tier scope, and then built a 223 trainer, then sold the second 700 and built another rifle on another custom action, and bought another top tier scope. Through the long line up upgrading and selling, I've lost enough $ on rifles/parts/gear, that I could have paid for one of the 2 custom built rifles or one of the scopes I now own free and clear.
OR and here's the big one, that could have paid for another barrel, and all the ammo through it that would have made me a better shooter. Long story short, buy once, cry once if you have any plans whatsoever of shooting Long Range competitively.
Can you go shoot local matches, have a good time at the range, etc without taking out a second mortgage? Absolutely, and for doing that a stock 700, RPR, Savage 10 or 12 LRP is more than enough. But like I said, it all depends on what you really want to do and how far down the rabbit hole you are wanting/willing to go.
On the subject of 6mm's , yes typically the barrels don't last all that long, I've completely shot out 3 different 6X47 Lapua Barrels in the last year and went about half way through another before selling the barreled action to another forum member here. That cartridge has a typical life of around 1400 rounds. There are some other options though. Hoser shoots a lot of 6mm Competition Match witch is an improved 243 Win and by virtue of it's case capacity allows both great velocity and barrel life by using a slower burning powder (H1000 in this case), pretty sure he's seeing somewhere around 3000 rounds on a barrel, I'm sure he'll chime in here at some point and can expand on that. Then there's the 6BRX which I shoot now and I expect a total round count of about 2000 rounds per barrel including break in, fire forming, and load development which should provide me with at least 1500 match quality rounds from a barrel and 6 Dasher is VERY similar.Quote:
Originally Posted by Calculated
For comparison a 260 Remington or a 6.5 Creedmoor typically last about 3000 rounds give or take.
Perfect answer. I'll never have the time to actually compete competitively, or practice that much, but I do like shooting for fun and would shoot local matches.Quote:
Originally Posted by XC700116
I'm willing and able to get a Savage in .260, toss it in a chassis and put a Burris XTR II on top. I'd likely never shoot the barrel out with my schedule, especially if I keep shooting for-fun 3 gun, too.
Shawn's insight is spot on, Particularly for the shooter who knows they will go the distance and be all-in at some point. My path has been nearly identical to his, and his advice is extremely sound.
For the unsure, the dabbler, the "for now" hobbiest, the alternative is to invest a little today and spend a bunch more down the road. If I were advising a brand new shooter who had no confidence they would end up neck deep in this game, I'd suggest a Ruger in .243 if you reload or 6.5 Creed if you don't. Add a Burris XTR II and all-in you'll be in the game for $2,500.
Is this the best solution? No way! Is it a reasonable solution for a guy who's unsure if this is a long time addiction or just a fad? Absolutely. Only you can determine the best course. Knowing what I know now, I wish I'd listened to the voices that said to spend the big dollars up front. On the other hand, $6k to $7K, all at once, would have been a sufficient deterrent way back when that it would have kept me out of the game and I'd never have given it a shot.
My best advice, when you distill it down, is to spend every penny you have to get started. Every dollar spent on glass and guns is well spent. Every dollar saved is likely pissed away. Spend what you've got and enjoy yourself. It's a very rewarding pastime, regardless of how much you invest. Just know that each and every dollar you "save" will likely cost you $2 in the end.
Tim sums it up better than I do, I tend to get a bit long winded (shocking right hahaha) But the last paragraph here pretty much sums up the entire idea of what I've been trying to convey.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim K
BTW ^^^^ He's the crack dealer that gave me my first taste of this game and it's been full tilt ever since.
I'm just starting to dabble in the longer range and I have a ruger precision rifle in .308. Works amazing. Ive been able to hit 18x18 steel at 600 yards decently consistent during my last trip to the range. Not bad for only my second time giving it a try. Eventually I'll need to move to shooting paper where I can see exactly where my shots are hitting and how tight of a group but for now, its just fun to bang some steel.
I was able to get a Steiner scope (3-15x) via this forum for a great deal. Most expensive optic I've ever had but its been well worth it. Super clear glass and the reticle is easy. I could use a little higher power but my range only goes to 600 so its fine for what I use. Eventually, I'd like to get something in the 20x+ but that's down the road.
Good optics and good guns will never be a waste of money.