Quote Originally Posted by Zundfolge View Post
The first wounds on the constitution were in 1913 with the 16th and 17th amendments ... which came about because of the rise of the Progressive movement and the Wilson presidency.

If you don't buy that (since you are establishing the line as "limits placed on government") then the first wound was 1919 with the passage of the 18th amendment (which used the constitution to limit the rights of the people instead of the power of the government for the first time).

My only point is that America has been infected with the disease of the left for longer than people realize. At this point the damage is what it is so it's somewhat academic to argue when the first wound was inflicted.
This would be an interesting discussion. The progressive movement and women's suffrage was a progression from the abolitionist movement. It is rather interesting to trace it back. At least the amendments followed a process, and I am OK with that even though I may or may not agree with them. If the programs in the New Deal followed the same process where say Social Security was created and limited to a program authorized by an amendment to the constitution, I might disagree but a least it would be defined and limited. However, by circumventing this process, anything can happen and it has. By opening the Commerce Clause as a catch all to any government program, we now have a multi-trillion dollar budget full of entitlement programs, the EPA, etc. I understand that this is the Nirvana of the people you mention, but it is their victory and the foundation of what we have today. And yes, the 16th amendment was a really stupid move!