WHY GLOCKS?!? WHY 9mm?!?

[Colorado Osprey]

Kimber in the past were one of a kind fine pieces of equipment like Detonics or someones custom shop like Ed Brown.

When they ramped up for mass production they left the prices the same as when they hand made and fitted one gun at a time. Is this fair to consumers? You bet! If a consumer doen't get informed before a purchase and they pay for the name brand, they bought an overpriced big named product. This doesn't mean they got hosed by any means. It just means they could have bought the same quality with a different name for less money. Maybe they really wanted a Kimber instead of a Custom shop gun. Name recognition helps in the re-sale market.

There are only so many ways to make a 1911, and most have been done. So Kimber having the same stuff as SA is like saying that Bushmaster AR's are like RRA, Olympic and Colt. For example Olympic Arms is the only manufacturer to have available a broach cut barrel for guaranteed accuracy and not offer chrome lining.

Sure by outward appearances they are all the same but there are small differences especially in manufacturing processes; not necessarily in fit, funtion or appearance.

[DanaT]

What round does CSPD use?

CSPD uses a round made for them by Winchester.
Brass cased, Black Talon, very high pressure like a +P+. Almost like sub gun ammo. The original Black Talon used nickel brass like Federal Hydra-Shoks. These rounds are waaay hotter than Hydra-Shok's. They actually kick.

OK. So they are using probably non-lubrilox Ranger SXT +p+ 127gr.

This is no secret. Winchester doesn't make "special" bullets of for one small police department.

The Ranger SXT +p+ fired out of a 3 inch sub will make about 1200ft/sec. Out of a glock 34 about 1300ft/sec. Considering factory 357 mag 125gr is around 1250ft/sec, yep, the SXT +P+ is about like a 357 mag.

As far as it cracking slides and busting guns, everything I have in 9mm has lived through the SXT rounds without problems.

Now that said, I still like 10mm, especially with Double Tap ammo.

-Dana

[DanaT]

I have my own theory on stopping power. However, my manifesto is still being written. Hopefully in a few weeks I will be done.

-Dana

[Colorado Osprey]

Olin...Winchester does sell the original Black Talon to law enforcement agencies, by special order only. These are labeled Black Talon not SXT, and they are black bullets. I also was informed that OLIN does indeed make these rounds specifically to CSPD's specs. Winchester Ranger ammo doesn't list the SXT or use brass (non-Nickel) in +P loads...according to their law enforcement web site.

http://www.winchester.com/lawenforce...1tIEx1Z2VyIFA=

As far as being a small department...LOL...it is one of the largest (like top 30) in the country. There really aren't any 'burbs to limit Colorado Springs size. It's like 9th or 10th for largest city in the country in square milage. But it gets no respect because it's not Denver.

I too carry the 10mm, Hornady XTP 155grain. It's fast, 1200fps, low recoil, and was issued plenty to last me. My handload 180 grain are about the same speed with XTP's but recoil is a bit stout.

[michael_aos]

I heard a little blurb on TV that the Los Angeles sheriffs department $1.7 billion-dollar budget is larger than many small countries.

Mike

[Colorado Osprey]

I heard a rumor that 1/3 of El Paso County's entire budget is given to the City of Colorado Springs for "community relations." I think Douglas Bruce stated it...District 2 County Commissioner.

EDIT: USMC03...I'm sorry...we've really hi-jacked your thread. I'll quit.

[DanaT]

For 10mm, those actually sound pretty weak.

The hottest easily obtained factory load I have used is Winchester Silver tips. 175gr and right at 1200ft/sec from a G20.

Now kick it up a notch and use double tap.

I chrono'ed some 165 double tap (golden saber bullet) out of a G20 and they were right at 1400ft/sec.

-Dana

[bbadmin]

I heard a little blurb on TV that the Los Angeles sheriffs department $1.7 billion-dollar budget is larger than many small countries.

Mike

And at one time LA County had the 7th largest helicopter air force in the world....



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[Han not-so-solo]

On a similar note....

Denver PD authorizes Glocks. But they don't authorize the .40. Its .45, or 9mm, but no .40.

Why no 40 caliber?