Parents!!! Bug Out, Hold up?

[tmckay2]

Our plan is to turn our home into a fortress. We have a large supply of food and other supplies to stay in our home if it is possible. We also have the firepower to deter anyone that would like to attempt entrance into our property. If staying in our home is not an option than we have plans for that as well.

and if they light it on fire from the outside?

to me bugging out is almost always the best option, unless you live in the middle of nowhere or at the very least outside of town. if you live in a populated area its a huge risk staying, and if you decide to stay you are likely stuck there after the first few days to a week. i get the draw to stay. it seems like a great storage place, easily fortifiable, etc. but i think if you sit and think about all the things potential perps could do to your house from the outside that you would have no control over and in the end basically be stuck, bugging out seems safer. my plan would be to get out of town and into the mountains via back roads. you wouldn't even have to go that far in to be much, much safer. itll be the last place people will search for goods and the like. would probably be months upon months before anyone would think about coming out that way, not until all of the supplies in town are dried up.

also, once stationed outside of town, it would be easy to run recon and make sure people aren't moving into your area. if you have a plan as to what to pack in your car and how to do it, you could bug out within 30 minutes and have a very nice stock of food, at least a few months worth, water, shelter, weapons, etc. i get why people stock up on 2-3 years worth of food, but frankly i don't think its likely youd need more than 6 months. if you don't have a significant plan for food after even just one month, you are an idiot anyways and won't make it. the extra food would make things easier and less stressful, but also makes you less mobile. just my opinion of course.

all of this being said, i have seriously considered custom building my house (when i buy one in the next 5-10 years) with concrete frame, bulletproof doors and windowns, a bunker in the basement with escape hatch, the whole works. if you buy a smaller sized place its not as expensive as youd assume. also, i would build it somewhere in the foothills in case escape is absolutely necessary.

anyone ever consider armored vehicles? ive tossed it around a bit in my mind. some humvee's are street legal and armored, you just have to look hard. v100 commandos are street legal in most cases although those are much more expensive, more in the 80k range. even a ferret might be useful.

[SA Friday]

I'm outa here... The front range would become chaos followed by famine and then disease. King Soopers and Wally world will turn into shooting galleries and gas stations will become fight clubs till all the stuff is gone.

I've been doing a lot of prepping lately. If I can't drive there I'll walk there, but I have a location that's sustainable and stocked. The move would be with my family, and the preparations for a walk with them have started.

The biggest thing I can think of is prestaging your stuff where you are going if you leave. The more you have to carry, the crappier it will be.

[Irving]

and if they light it on fire from the outside?

to me bugging out is almost always the best option, unless you live in the middle of nowhere or at the very least outside of town. if you live in a populated area its a huge risk staying, and if you decide to stay you are likely stuck there after the first few days to a week. i get the draw to stay. it seems like a great storage place, easily fortifiable, etc. but i think if you sit and think about all the things potential perps could do to your house from the outside that you would have no control over and in the end basically be stuck, bugging out seems safer. my plan would be to get out of town and into the mountains via back roads. you wouldn't even have to go that far in to be much, much safer. itll be the last place people will search for goods and the like. would probably be months upon months before anyone would think about coming out that way, not until all of the supplies in town are dried up.

also, once stationed outside of town, it would be easy to run recon and make sure people aren't moving into your area. if you have a plan as to what to pack in your car and how to do it, you could bug out within 30 minutes and have a very nice stock of food, at least a few months worth, water, shelter, weapons, etc. i get why people stock up on 2-3 years worth of food, but frankly i don't think its likely youd need more than 6 months. if you don't have a significant plan for food after even just one month, you are an idiot anyways and won't make it. the extra food would make things easier and less stressful, but also makes you less mobile. just my opinion of course.

all of this being said, i have seriously considered custom building my house (when i buy one in the next 5-10 years) with concrete frame, bulletproof doors and windowns, a bunker in the basement with escape hatch, the whole works. if you buy a smaller sized place its not as expensive as youd assume. also, i would build it somewhere in the foothills in case escape is absolutely necessary.

anyone ever consider armored vehicles? ive tossed it around a bit in my mind. some humvee's are street legal and armored, you just have to look hard. v100 commandos are street legal in most cases although those are much more expensive, more in the 80k range. even a ferret might be useful.

Why do you think that your bug out tent/cabin/etc would be any more defensible, or fireproof, than your home? What will you do when they set it on fire from the outside?

Why do you think that people won't be going to the mountains? EVERYONE with a 4 wheel drive will be heading toward the mountains.

Why do you think that the people already occupying the foothills are just going to let you into their area? I've got a cabin on the other side of the divide, but I'm hardly there, and the locals sure as hell wouldn't let me get there.

[tmckay2]

I never said a tent was more fireproof. The idea is to get away from people so it doran have to be. I'm not going to pitch it in someones front yard in the foothills where do you get this stuff? I'm just saying you don't need to drive 5 hours in to the mountains. Two hours in would be plenty to find a desolate place. And FYI the others going there in the four wheel drive vehicles are likely semi preppers themselves. Libtards will stay in town and wait for daddy government to come back. Those are the ones you have to worry about. Those are the first to get violent when all the sudden they have to be self reliant. Those are the people you avoid. Also there is plenty of real estate in he mountains to hide you just have to look into it

Why do you think that your bug out tent/cabin/etc would be any more defensible, or fireproof, than your home? What will you do when they set it on fire from the outside?

Why do you think that people won't be going to the mountains? EVERYONE with a 4 wheel drive will be heading toward the mountains.

Why do you think that the people already occupying the foothills are just going to let you into their area? I've got a cabin on the other side of the divide, but I'm hardly there, and the locals sure as hell wouldn't let me get there.

[2008f450]

We would stay put as long as possible. If that wouldnt work we head toward plan B which is stocked almost as well as home. If that didnt work we go mobile. I think a lot of the general public (unprepared) will bug out to family, friends, or other locations first. so staying put would be a better first choice for us. Just arm the wife,the kids,give them radios,and rely on the plan to keep us safe.

[roberth]

Unless there is a specific threat which is forcing me out, I'm bugging in with the wife and kids. Bugging out is something that should not be considered lightly, with or without family.

I think bugging out "to the wild blue yonder" is an absolute last ditch option (but one that should be considered and planned for).

And I would say you are correct. I spent a few years preparing for staying at home. It was only after I was at a point that I could stay here that I ever thought about leaving.

I am at the point that I could but if you look through the posts you will find that I am also at a stage that leaving would be for what? I am 53 and have lived a full life. The leaving part becomes less attractive as the years go by.

all the kids are grown and only a couple have any interest in being prepared. If you are 39 or under and have kids then you need to plan. You and your children would be the future.

There have been generations before us and there will be generations after. In all honesty the last big scare was in 61. We are marching to a different kind of threat these days.

Just some thoughts.

Yup, bug in. No point in leaving only to get bogged down with everyone else who is leaving.

Imagine what the freeways would be like...total chaos.

[tmckay2]

Yup, bug in. No point in leaving only to get bogged down with everyone else who is leaving.

Imagine what the freeways would be like...total chaos.

you of course don't use the freeways. everyone knows that much. also the number of people leaving early on would be nil. hardly anyone is prepared to survive anywhere else and they would all make the mistake of sticking around too long to try to wait it out, only to realize they now can't leave. if you left fairly early youd have no problem other than being ridiculed as a nut.

[SpikeMike]

My wife and I had yet another of those discussions last night. She's all for hunkering down and bugging-in. Which is all good and fine until you get lots of hungry people, injured people, or worse.... bad people (e.g. criminals and/or roving government security contractors i.e. Blackwater type folks with a FEMA mandate) running about.

Getting out of Littleton for us could be a major problem, especially if the roads were choked. I-25, I-70, US-285, etc. would be a nightmare of epic proportions as everyone and their mother will be leaving (most without a clue as to where or why they are going). Which brings into play having the knowledge of every little back road (paved or not) as alternates. Most maps do not have all of those roads listed and the only way to know about them is from topos or direct knowledge of having traveled them. Good routes include knowing every single old mining road/path and passes. Which means having a suitable 4x4 in good working condition with good tires and spares.

A practice I put into play for our vehicles are black-out lenses for all lights, with a manual switch for disabling the indicator lights. Less light means you're less noticed. A good pair of NVGs for night travel with lights out is huge (if you can afford them).

The problems of bugging-in for those of us in urban/suburban environments will depend on the level of disaster and type of disaster. The first 24 hrs is the great wait-and-see game. The second 24 hrs is the I-gotta-get-out-and-see time. People will have access to enough water and food over that 48 hour period. After that, it begins to get sketchy. People will start taking what they think they need. Then many will begin the panic of I got to leave and leave now. That's where the roads bog down even more. Arguments will ensue over gasoline, food, water, slow traffic, and so chaos begins with little order. What LEO and Fire/EMS services remain will be stressed and stretched. Locally and haphazardly implemented martial law will come into play. Turf will begin at some point to become established, neighborhood by neighborhood. Pretty dismal, eh? The truth of it all is that we are pack or herd animals and still have that tribal mentality in our genes. It is a means of survival and entirely instinct based.

Where will our Federal government be? At first, they will be sitting on their fat butts, two thumbs up where the sun does not shine. They will be trying to establish Command and Control Centers, region by region. Figuring out what resources they have to bring to bear and finding out they have a lot less than they thought or budgeted for. Deals will be made and rules of engagement will be set, do not expect the latter to be in the favor of John Q. Public.

Somewhere in a dark room will be some of them deciding who are the trouble-makers. In their infinite wisdom, most of their databases are stored in hardened networks of servers. They know a lot more about us than any of us would like them to know (perhaps not to the level the UK government goes to, but still...get the point?). They will know who the majority of gun-owners are, who the criminals are, and who belongs to a militia or other affiliation they do not like. Under Martial Law, they have the right to suspend the US Constitution, meaning they can come and take (not ask) your firearms. They can take you gasoline, your food, your water, even the clothes or other items without regard to your rights. They have the right to arrest you and hold you, or to even outright execute on the spot for failing to comply.

Bugging-in is nice if you're well protected, careful, and have the means and knowledge to maintain a very low profile. Bugging-out is an eventuality everyone must prepare for.

[OutdoorsNative]

I wasn't trying to say I would stay in my home no matter what. Whatever situation you are dealing with will decide what you do. I will say I wouldn't be bugging out without giving it some thought. I treat my home like a base. I am well prepared to deter any threats and if the situation called for it I am prepared to not allow anyone to get close to it.

[Bootifus]

I think there are many scenarios that I would stay put, and a few that I actually would break for the hills. I have 3 boys (10, 3 and 1.5). The eldest could hang pretty well in a survival situation, but the others are too young to haul out of the house for any but the direst of situations.
The current plan is to find 100 acres to split with a good local friend. I would stock that location and feel comfortable taking the boys there. but until that time, I think we are most apt to hold up at home.