IDPA state match questions

[mac266]

I'm hoping to shoot the state match this year, and I have a few questions.

I'm a full-time LEO, and I shoot IDPA with my duty gun and rig. I know club level matches make an exception for the concealment garment when using actual duty gear, will this apply at the state match, too?

Also, my gear has a Taser holster, because I carry one at work. We do not take our Tasers home, though; we check it out at the beginning of each shift and turn it in at the end of the shift. Will having an empty Taser holster somehow be a rules violation? I've been shooting that way at club matches, but again, don't know if things will change at the state match.

Finally, I don't carry my radio at club matches, either. They cost just under $4000 to replace and my department WILL hold me accountable if it gets broken or lost off-duty.

Would it be wise to invest in the plastic "blue guns" for the radio and Taser, or will they be ok with having empty holders on my duty rig?

Lastly, how many people have signed up? I'm waiting to shoot the classifier before I send in my app, but I don't want to wait too long.

[Hoser]

As Colorado law does not grant any exceptions (even on a shooting range) for people to carry a concealed weapon when they dont have a permit for it, it is not mandatory. Cover garmet is encouraged, but not mandatory.

An empty Taser holster or radio holster isnt a big deal at all.

The match is a long way away and we dont yet have 20 people signed up. The sooner people get their app in, the easier it is for me to honor squad requests.

You are aware it is a two day match? Saturday *and* Sunday....

You gonna be shooting a M&P by then or will you be shooting the brick?

[mac266]

Tom, thanks for the answers. You're the MD, right? That way, when someone raises a stink about my lack of a concealment garment (which is a ridiculous notion with a police rig), and empty radio / taser holders, I can just send them your direction, right?

Anyway, I AM aware it is a two day match. The only two day matches I've shot before were in SASS, and I don't get worn out Seriously, the best days of the police academy were shooting 10 hours a day for two weeks straight [postal] [postal] [postal]

Lastly, I'll still be shooting the brick. They haven't started the changeover yet, and won't do everyone at once. It's policy to replace a gun every five years *if* the officer wants to. So they'll "phase" the ol' bricks out over time, and issue all new personnel the M&P. My gun has three years to go, and I'm still undecided if I'll make the change.

No, I don't like the brick (S&W 5906 TSW for you curious minds), but I've never been one to run out and get the newest stuff just because it's new. I like to wait around and see what other peoples' experiences show about its reliability, etc. Heck, I'm just now getting to the point where I'd buy something in .40 S&W! Hasn't that been around for 15-20 years? I think it'll stay around :mrgreen:

[Hoser]

Tom, thanks for the answers. You're the MD, right?

I am just the sign-up geek and minister of information dude. If anyone has a problem with no cover garment, refer them to the rulebook, Colorado law, and then me.

Anyway, I AM aware it is a two day match.

I only mention it cause you dont shoot the IDPA or IPSC matches in Pueblo as they are on Sundays. Didnt want anyone to get caught off guard.

[SigsRule]

Tom,
I'm in Houston today and just shot a IDPA sanctioned match with the PSC club. Everybody here had concealment even though I'm sure not all are CCW permit holders - I know because I overheard a CCW instructor telling a number of the shooters (who happened to be all women) about the CCW class.

Haven't we been shooting from concealment in IDPA long before CO passed the "shall issue"?

I checked the final rule book from February 2005 and it specifically exempts concealment when wearing "duty gear" but otherwise concealment is required "where appropriate". In the previous version of the rule book not drawing from concealment was a procedural error, but the current rule book doesn't mention that. Nor does the current rule book define "where appropriate" but I would guess that means stages where the gun is other than in the holster, like some of the recent scenarios.

Are you sure about the state prohibition in sanctioned matches about concealment when not a CCW holder?

[Hoser]

Tom, Are you sure about the state prohibition in sanctioned matches about concealment when not a CCW holder?

Yes.

Cover garments have never been mandatory for any Front range IDPA Match.

[F. Paul]

Tom,

I think the CCW statute actually does provides an exception to the general prohibition against concealed carry. CRS 18-12-105 (2) (a) specifically creates an exception where the concealed carry takes place on property under an individual's control with the consent of the landowner.

This seems to be the situation when a member uses CCCSC facilities - he does so with with control of the property and with the consent of the landowner by virtue of his\her membership. CCW by guests might be a closer call.

If this were not the case and if concealed carry on the CCCSC facility is in fact illegal, then encouraging another to wear cover garments should NEVER occur until first determining whether the competitor is a CCW holder. That's because (and technically speaking) any individual who encourages another to commit a violation can be prosecuted as an abettor of the underlying crime.

In my experience a prosecution arising under these facts would be highly unlikely and nothing short of ludicrous. However, if this issue causes concern, CCCSC should seek a formal opinion letter from the Clear Creek County district attorney's office.

About 30% of my law practice is in Clear Creek and I'd be happy to address the issue with the prosecutor's office if someone thought it would help - or we could just let sleeping dogs lie.

Thanks for all your hard work and especially for your "the buck stops here" philosophy.


Paul

[Hoser]

mac266, you post last week got lost when the board died this weekend. I understand your comments and concerns. However, clearly stated on the match app is

Use of a concealment garment is strongly encouraged.

The app is downloadble/viewable at http://www.coloradoshooting.org/FRID..._EntryForm.doc

If anyone has more questions about this policy, please contact the Match Director, President of Front Range IDPA or IDPA HQ in Berryville AR.

Please keep in mind we will be looking for match director for the 2008 match shortly after this years match. Its a completely thankless job but at least the hours are long and the pay nill.

[Hoser]

but I don't want to wait too long.

Should I be looking for an app from you? Its close to being too late.

[eerw]

when will be too late???
got my app in my briefcase..but still on the road..will next week be too late??